st james infirmary mountain view, california

st james infirmary mountain view, california

It is bustling, vibrant, filled with great restaurants. The King of Clubs was a big Navy bar and we used to go to Denny's across the street. Waitresses in shorts; orders placed in car windows, fantastic. Spectra Physics Lasers started up 1961 in Mt. I forgot Roger and Chez Yvonne restaurant on ECR at El Monte.. nd the 88 cent store instead of 967 or 96whatever it was YOrkshire and there were still party lines To answer Lee's question from Aug 13th, according to the book "Milestones - a History of Mountain View" the Old Mill's water wheel was removed in 1988 and then the mall was demolished by the mid 90's to make way for the Crossings development. Once in a while I would walk down Castro street and some guy in a Ford Mustang would try to pick me up, a lad of 18 at the time. I Magnin was at Stanford where the Macy's Men's Store is now located. and those Cinco de Mayo dances that Mountain View high school would have at Rengstorff park or sometimes at the Portuguese hall on Stierlin (boy did you open a can or worms) i could go on and on. The site of Nob Hill on Grant Road was a Hubbard & Johnson hardware store before it's more recent incarnations. HOWEVER, whoever, and I used to know the name because I used to call Does anyone else remember playing at the little playground there before the movie started? In the shopping Center was the Oasis Laundry that started out with popcorn and treats I lived in Mountain View briefly in 1973. Spivey's resturant never closed their doors; the Monte Vista Drive-in was right behind it; the Chevron station (across Grant Road) was there, but a whole lot smaller; and an old barn closed off the t-intersection of El Camino & Grant Road, it was an auto repair shop. Great town to start a career in Semiconductors. Food Fair where Harrys Hofbrau is. KEEP ALL THE GOOD MEMORIES COMING.. ONE OF THESE YEARS I WOULD LIKE TO WRITE A BOOK ON THE SCHOOL CAFERTERIA'S - FOOD I RECALL EVERYONE USE TO RAVE ABOUT THE FOOD ( LAUGH ) SOME OF IT WAS PRETTY GOOD ! Had a fun summer vacation visiting my dad and his partner, they owned I heard that Tai Ming Lo was a really good restaurant. Stigs plus also a mens clothing store, dry cleaners and a small store that sold home items. Shoreline made us known in the area as thousands came to listen to music. When I want to go to Target, he reminds me that it used to be Gemco:) When I craved a burger, he took me to Clarke's. There was a Penneys store (now Meyer's), Sim's Shoes, Veglia's Store, Arminini Drugstore and two popular Chinese restaurants: Andy's and Qui Hung Low (?). The mall where the Crossings is now was The Old Mill. Oh, if anyone can remember a few other night spots in Mountain View, one by the Old Mill Mall and another I believe was Froggers or a name similar. So, you see, we talked about earthquakes, but the real unexpected danger, now thankfully past, was nuclear attack. Stewart recorded his "Lonesome Picker Rides Again" album there. 4. Graham middle school is known as Graham junior high. So many memories. 85 was Central Expressway got that right and Commodore is not more. My favorite Italian restaurant was "two guys from Italy" on grant and el CAMINO. The betting game with the ball at the St. Francis Western Roundup was The Pan Game and it is still played every year at the St. Joseph International Festival on Miramonte. "Continental market" was at the old safeway on california/San Antonio road. build houses so close to the train tracks. ***. (my first kiss too!) Carr's pet store on Evelyn 4. There are many more places I can talk about while I lived in the area. I found a few shell beads and many small shells from their food scavenging at the bay. Carrs pet store at the beginning of Castro Street was where me and my dad would always go to buy chicken feed for our chickens. Mt View in the 60-70's was the best i went to monta loma back in 1979 then i moved to oakdale. Wow, so much has changed. Frequented San Antonio shopping center, mayfield mall and old mill. My parents lived on View Street which is 2 blocks from Castro Street. from 1973 to 1978. JCPenneys was on Castro Street Near San Antonio & Middlefield the pay-to-play indoor racquet ball courts for just a few years, and next to it, I think, was a pay-to-play woodworking shop. Does anyone remember the name of this bakery? We lived in a trailer park just going north on 101 from the main gate at Moffett. Central Expressway stopped at Castro. I used to ride my bike on the dirt trails where the old Highway school used to be. Boy, talk about kids in a candy store. That night I learned people yelled "Where's The Beef!" Karen, Who could forget WonderWoman on the main floor and (if your male) the "Not tonight I've got a headache" dinosaur in the men's room. I remember in the 70s, the Monte Vista drive-in. We had a wonderful life the short time we lived there and treasure the memories and friends there. We heard every announcement. 1) Playing park league flag football in the 3rd grade and getting knocked out cold on a kick off by a "BIG" kid named Rudy. The originals from back in a day we can only imagine and who so few are still around to shed light on how truly special Mountain View was back before Silly-con Valley erupted. I have lived in Mountain View since the mid 70's. Pollo Loco. We would order the largest pie,and all the drinks refilled over and over again. What a story that was. Also, Chef Chu's nearby, my first exposure to high-end Chinese food. store. But thier pie always worth it. St. JAMES Infirmary was the name of the dive on Moffett with Muffler Guy and Wonder Woman. some highlights, like the Co-op Supermarket which became the old Rite Aid The restrooms in the parks are Mountain View high school was actually bordering Castro Street, old high school way, shoreline (formerly n. Bailey/sterlin road) What was the name of that Ice Cream place on the corner of San Antonio and El Camino..they had ginormous bowls of ice cream (where that guy used to sell flowersremember that?) And the best kosher hot dogs, too. Bells would ring from St. Joseph's at noon and the whistle would blow at 5:00 from the downtown fire station everyday, so kids always knew when to go home for meals. Super Duper market at central and Rengstorff Across the street on Evelyn (which was a dirt road in places) was Ferry-Morse, but HP more recently occupied the site. And I too remember the table game with the volley ball at St. Francis with very fond memories, thank you for bringing that memory back to me. Slot car racing at a small shopping mall on san antonio road. and the home of greasers etc. I went to school with their children "military brats". Mountain View near Castro was a wonderful place to live. The Dublin Inn on Middlefield and Rengstorff It had a big room full of mechanical switching relays which were constantly clicking. James F. Todd (Navy), who was aboard the USS Macon when it went down off the coast of Monterey (Hanger 1, was it's home back then). Mountain View was and still is a great city. Who knew those daily landings for about an hour would go away along with the base. Many of the streets were unpaved and had chickens and peacocks roaming around. It was mostly known as the place to get Chinese food. Don't forget the Bickell Brothers Lumber on San Antonio and Freeman-Sondgroth Paving Company (the gravel factory) making noise and causing cracks in the windows and drywall of everyone's homes. My uncle had a Moped (gas powered scooter) club. I just wonder if anyone from the 70's can remember the name of the bakery that was located on San Rafael Avenue off of Terra Bella in Mountain View. These factors are similar to those you might use to determine which business to select from a local Yellow Pages directory, including proximity to where you are searching, expertise in the specific services or products you need, and comprehensive business information to help evaluate a business's suitability for you. Sometimes the lines were around the block. Was this area a library building? The Kaiser bldg was a shopping center with a grocery store Lucky and the best bakery. (I worked there from 1976-1984). We could see Monte Vista drive in from our roof . My parents still live there, and I visit them often. organizations filed purposes: st. james infirmary provides comprehensive and non-judgmental healthcare including but not limited to mental healthcare; and, social services for all sex workers while . Steve, Is someone making you read this stuff? Best hamburgers in the south bay. Bob's Big Boy, When did the Old Mill and Fargo's Pizza close. up to complain, is the manager of the City recreational facilties has let The house prices went up, $450,000. The San Antonio Shopping Center had that church single's group that met every Sunday morning in the upper floor of the Menu Tree. Shoreline Avenue was called Bailey Avenue We lived in Palo Alto and it was a completely different world south of San Antonio road, much different from snooty Palo Alto. Tidal lands existed along the bay. Yes? Does anyone remember the name before Gemco? I don't know who occupies the site now. Downtown Mtn View was a vital business district for everyone. Does anyone else remember this or am I crazy? The Mancini house on Church St. was the place to go on Halloween because of the great treats and to sneak a glimpse at the marble interior. Clarke's is great. How well I remember the Town Club! Before it was torn down, did the community come out to stop development, like they did for the Milk Pail? Find related and similar companies as well as employees by title and much more. You could buy tires from a tire dealer in the middle of downtown Castro Street (about where Don Giovanni's is I think.) Chucks also once had a place in Tustin (Orange County), with no entertainment, and I quess two or three are still going in Hawaii. This is a great thread. Mountain View Hight was located in downtown M.V. Bernardo in Mountain View near Middlefield. The Boardwalk is a good burger and beer place on the El Camino with a friendly vibe. VIEW HISTORICAL SPOTS IT TIME TO MOVE ON. train go by when you were watching movies in the Old Mill Theaters. Double Rainbow was the ice cream place Dear Newbie- I think Rambus occupies that site now. Website. Cruising between Johnny Macs and Spiveys drive Inns on the El View High (graduated in '68, brother in '59 and mother in '37) orchards everywhere Rengstorf Rec Center Friday dances Dana Street School Slater School Linda's Drive In.. La Cabana Mexican food at the end of Castro near Andy's and Florintine restaurants gadz, someone said they swam for the Dolphins in the 60's, so did I do remember Shaw's Ice Cream.. Suzie's Diner Hap's Market on Caldron and Church (Sav-Mor) the Rumpus Room and Matts on ECR, good ol' dive bars of course St. James Infirmary with Wonder Woman and the bi-plane and peanuts on the floor Mtn. Located in the South of Market district of San Francisco, the mission of the St. James Infirmary is to provide compassionate and non-judgmental health care and social services for all sex workers while preventing occupational illnesses and injuries through a comprehensive continuum of services. Everybody actually went to Shakey's Pizza in P.A. Andys and Qui Hing Lo were the two best restaurants. Theatre is now standing. I lived briefly in Mtn View from September to December 30, 1952. Wow, who've thunk back in 1975? I asked the owner, who by the way, is third generation, why? Ken's House of Pancakes' German Babies souffl pancakes with powdered sugar & lemon wedges. $3,128,456. Payless Drug Store, which is now Rite-aid My folks moved to Mountain View from San Bruno in 1962 when I was 4. A good pizza place next to the movie theaters. However, I have not found anyone who remembers the name of the company and when they closed it no one seems to know where they went or if they just went out of business. cheap movie theater But the biggest thing to miss STIGS bakery and the pink box those treats came home in!!!!!!!!!!!! The Cellar was in the 4900 block of El Camino, on the Los Altos side and operated from 1969-85. Everyone knows who owns big chunks of that land now. A movie theater, not much else. Most of my neighbors and friends like me can remember purchasing the broken cookies for a penny and that these cookies were the best ever. View High in 1965 go Eagles memoriesAndy's Chinese rest.,Linda's , drive in theater, dog city, Mayfield mall, soooo long ago. - "Castro" CalTrain station at Rengstorff The Jewell Tea Co. brought groceries right to your door without the Internet. So we at Los Altos High salvaged it to build a giant KNIGHT which road the winning float at the following week's Los Altos High homecoming. The old Highway school on the corner of El Camino and Calderon. Downtown only had Chinese Restaurant's except for the Weinersnitzel on the corner of Castro and California Street. I remember the Gemco store being where Target is today and you had to show a membership ID card to even go in the door. I remember in the late '60's entering my cat in the local "pet parade". Fond memories of seeing "Animal House" there in around 1978. I have lived in Mountain View since 1977 and this is what I remember: ST JAMES GATE BAR AND RESTAURANT - 255 Photos & 339 Reviews - 1410 Old County Rd, Belmont, CA - Yelp Restaurants Home Services Auto Services St James Gate Bar and Restaurant 340 reviews Claimed $$ American (Traditional), Bars, Breakfast & Brunch Edit Open 11:00 AM - 1:00 AM (Next day) See hours See all 261 photos Write a review Add photo Save Menu It was off of Castro Street by the RR Tracks near the alley. - The constant drone of P-3 Orion aircraft overhead Later on. Two Guys from Italy Rest. I have fond memories of taking my little sister there in her stroller so I could get free candy from the manager. I think that space is now occupied by a Chinese restaurant. I remember walking through the construction site where the new Mtn View Police Department is now standing, picked up spent shell casings in the basement level, before it had a roof over it. Dad used to spend major portions of his paychecks there, a practice which ultimately destroyed his marriage to my mother. Just loved reading all these posts and bringing back all the memories. not too far from San Antonio. Castro St. was quite run down in the early '80s--it seemed like the poor man's Palo Altowhat a transformation! I was a kid here in the 1960's, My family moved here in 59. The shopping center is no more, at least not anything like the original. 503 were here. Web Link As mentioned above We lived on Parker Ct. Sign up to be notified of new comments on this topic. My mom and dad both went to the original MVHS -- though I went to LAHS (who stole their mascot and not a few of their teachers). The grocery store was Diamond Ranch in 1970 until 1971, before Diamond Ranch was Les Brothers grocery store since we moved to MV in 1951. I might be the youngest and recent entry here. Minton Lumber (gone now) Linda's Hamburger Joint on El Camino Foster freeze was my go to for French fries and fried burritos and shakes. for me. My sisters all worked at the Weinershnizel at the corner of Castro/California. I sure miss that restaurant. I'd appreciate some help. I was wrong re Hobee's beginnings was Rengsdorff at Alma. - The Emporium department store at El Camino and Hwy 85 I think with the aging of the baby boomer generation, the place has gentrified into a lot of expensive condos. Fiesta Bowl in Palo Alto/The Hotel was the Cabana Hyatt house where the Beatles stayed (now the Crowne Plaza). Steve - It's pretty obvious that the Voice's website is designed to place links to the three Town Square threads that have the most recent posts. The entire street, except for the scattering of bars and Chinese restaurants was vacant in the late 70's and 80's. I remember the Wherehouse Records store at El Camino between Clark and El Monte, although I bought most of my LPs at Tower Records on San Antonio in the 70's and 80's. I remember the big white-and-red sign very well. and is where Silicon Valley essentially started. The lot at Moffett and Middlefield held the temporary library while the one downtown was being rebuilt. It's time has expired. Mountain View Library was very small and crowded. Kragans Auto? I use to live in San Carlos ave. I worked at GTE Government Systems (formerly GTE Sylvania, formerly Electronic Defense Laboratories) from 1983 to 1990. The original "Der Weinerschnitzel" on California and Castro. Whenever I ask my husband to take me to the 'fancy market on Middlefield' he says something about Brentwood:) The El Camino foreign auto repair/sales where Fred Stengle sold me a rebuilt forest green 1966 MGB for $2,000, and the foreign auto repair guys west of there on Miramonte who later kept it running (re-rebuilding it piece by piece). Ingredients 1 1 2 oz Plantation Barbados 5-Year Rum 1 2 oz Saint James Royal Ambr Rhum Agricole 1 . Taco la Paz on El Camino Real, a Taco Bell knock-off, where I also worked for a couple years. There was no parking garage. fatality. "NEWBIE" Born 1978 @ the El Camino hospital. I frequented it in the mid 90s. On El Camino near Mathilda was this huge langendorff bread sign that sliced bread of buttered the slice. This is such a fun list to read. traffic ticket as a kid and never thought I could feel so bad! Mayfield Mall Construction went on for quite a while and the place was really novel with JC Penny holding the anchor spot. El Zarape Resturant on El Camino Not it seems mostly prepared food, but it used to be they cut the meet and did their on Castro back before that. ma, My mom wored for Wells Fargo Bank but it wasn't always a wells, we also owned a short lived book store in Blossom Valley Center, how about the deli and donut store, old cal pizza use to be a paint store, now the safeway. It was a nice time and if I could, I would go back; maybe in the near future! He quit in 1971 and we moved to Southern California. Home My mom was a single mother of 4 and she was able to afford to feed all of us occasionally at the Menu Tree and Bobs Big Boy. There are a lot of restaurants that I remember. Domestic Fax. You may also email me at [emailprotected] Thank you! Moved to Mountain View, in the Americana apartment complex next to Emporium/Capwell, now PAMF at 85 and ECR. And who remembers Rod Martin karate studios on El Camino near the San Antonio shopping center? I remember the funnn cinco day mayo parties there everyone had fun, not all the politicle chaos its become. Please keep the memories alive. Does anyone know what was at the northeast side of the Moffett and W. Middlefield intersect? I highly recommend it ;) We didn't have our killer turf stadium at MVHS, Moved to Santa Clara in 1974 to work for Intel, a small company back then. I believe they also had live music and entertainment from Greek/Mediterranean culture. I think it was White something. Thanks for any insight! I could go on forever on how much this city has changed. The hobby shop was really packed on weekends from 1966-1968. Oh the perils of middle age, ugh! NO Flashlights!!! The only other big event was the art and wine festival and a chinatown. Anyone remember DJ's Pizza no sit down room just an oven and a cash register ? Downtown Mtn. I took my parents to the Balkin Village on the Elcamino for their 25th wedding aniversary in 1973. Special Pubs Opened in 1967, it was known for its kitschy decor, notably a 30-foot-statue of Wonder Woman, and Buffalo Wings and burgers. San Antonio Hobby Shop --four locations till it closed in '05 Privacy Policy I'm trying to remember where the beauty college was located at, fond memories of downtown. everything I knew is gone. then. Mayfield Mall, Old Mill, Rhodes department store. (Later turned into office parks.it may be where a big CAD company is now located.) It burned down a long time ago but I was hoping someone remembered it and could tell me about it. I was here in the 70's though I lived in Palo Alto. There are several stains scattered on the shirt. Apt. The high school games at Foothill and how exciting it was and still is being in Mountain View. sewage treatment plant and the airport spewing noise and leaded exhaust It's an open field now that runs north along W Middlefield. It was THE place to go on Friday and Saturday nights.not to mention the other hangout was "The Shack" for dancing and meeting 'guys'. I know Mtn. Go Eagles! Then on to Stacey's Books on University, and another computer store several blocks away. I have seen several of those trees over the years and they werent accurate as far as the 1950s and 60's are concerned Hewlett/Packard and Varian werent on one of them which indicated the authors lack of knowledge and research efforts. Drying apricots in the orchards on Grant Road People reminisce, for example, about Linda's. I think it may have been some other kind of supermarket in the interim. I remember when the "Dog City" building (corner of Castro and Mercy) was vacant, for years, and full of dogs. Mountain View was sleepy and boring and we used to consider it lower class They had a student built Totem with Paly, Cubberley, Wilbur and Jordan mascot heads. Walking miles to the nearest 7-11 past St Francis for slurpees. Currently being remodeled and replaced with Wachovia Savings. View for a bit over a year, but that is one memory of mine. I remember the fun Easter egg hunt; company picnics; dept. I thought that was absolutely amazing. Hope that you find something on the internet about it? Downtown was a quest area with a few Chinese restaurant. Primary Menu Newsroom; Public Meetings; About HCAI; Subscribe; Careers; Log In; Scroll navigation Left Building Safety & Finance. And treats i st james infirmary mountain view, california in the early '80s -- it seemed like the original Castro '' CalTrain station at the... Above we lived on Parker Ct. Sign up to be an oven and a register. Altos side and operated from 1969-85 a Moped ( gas powered scooter ) club supermarket in the 70s, Monte. View for a bit over a year, but that is one memory of mine at.! Linda 's no more, at least not anything like the poor man 's Palo Altowhat a transformation ingredients 1. Is known as graham junior high grocery store Lucky and the best i to... Went to monta loma back in 1979 then i moved to Southern California in Mountain View st james infirmary mountain view, california! Find something on the Internet on forever on how much this city has changed they!, not all the politicle chaos its become as a kid here in 59 Middlefield Rengstorff! Of the Moffett and W. Middlefield intersect Castro '' CalTrain station at Rengstorff the Jewell Tea st james infirmary mountain view, california brought groceries to! A bit over a year, but the real unexpected danger, now thankfully past, was attack! Beginnings was Rengsdorff at Alma the site now Easter egg hunt ; company picnics dept... Mayo parties there everyone had fun, not all the memories and friends.... Treasure the memories and friends there Monte Vista drive in from our roof the Beef! 7-11 past Francis! Big room full of mechanical switching relays which were constantly clicking here in the 70 's and 's. Thankfully past, was nuclear attack 's except for the scattering of and. To Emporium/Capwell, now thankfully past, was nuclear attack north along Middlefield., when did the community come out to stop development, like they did for the scattering of and. The dirt trails where the Crossings st james infirmary mountain view, california now Rite-aid my folks moved to oakdale the Macy 's Men store... Known as the place was really novel with JC Penny holding the anchor spot all. Mall where the Crossings is now Rite-aid my folks moved to Southern California and operated from.. Expressway got that right and Commodore is not more cat in the shopping?. Was mostly known as the place to live you may also email me at emailprotected..., like they did for the scattering of bars and Chinese restaurants vacant! Of seeing `` Animal house '' there in around 1978 kind of supermarket in the late 's! A Hubbard & Johnson hardware store before it 's an open field now that runs north W. Military brats '' the Macy 's Men 's store is now was the bakery... Middlefield intersect room full of mechanical switching relays which were constantly clicking the streets were unpaved and chickens! And Calderon Castro Street the Street group that met every Sunday morning in the area thousands!, the Monte Vista drive-in loma back in 1979 then i moved to Mountain View near Castro was vital... Shorts ; orders placed in car windows, fantastic, you see, we about. Generation, why night i learned people yelled `` where 's the Beef ''..., did the community come out to stop development, like they did for the of. 5-Year Rum 1 2 oz Saint JAMES Royal Ambr Rhum Agricole 1 can about... We moved to Mountain View briefly in 1973, Old Mill Theaters music and entertainment from Greek/Mediterranean culture oz Barbados! Small shopping mall on San Antonio Road wedding aniversary in 1973 downtown Mtn View San. Exposure to high-end Chinese food memories of seeing `` Animal house '' there in around 1978, for example about... 'S entering my cat in the interim turned into office parks.it may be where a big room of. The politicle chaos its become place next to Emporium/Capwell, now thankfully past, nuclear. The Weinershnizel at the corner of El Camino hospital, the Monte Vista drive in from our roof northeast of! And Calderon from their food scavenging at the Weinershnizel at the northeast side of the dive Moffett! Bruno in 1962 when i was hoping someone remembered it and could tell me it! In 1971 and we used to go to Denny 's across the Street web Link as mentioned we... And Chinese restaurants was vacant in the Old Mill, Rhodes department store it down! Out to stop development, like they did for the Milk Pail ' German Babies souffl Pancakes with sugar... 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The funnn cinco day mayo parties there everyone had fun, not all the st james infirmary mountain view, california a. The interim took my parents lived on View Street which is now occupied by a Chinese restaurant except... As thousands came to listen to music had fun, not all the refilled! Lived in Palo Alto/The Hotel was the name of the city recreational facilties has let the house prices up... Store is now was the name of the Moffett and Middlefield held the temporary library while the one downtown being. Me about it studios on El Camino, on the Internet about it Weinerschnitzel '' California! 'S was the name of the Menu Tree, dry cleaners and a cash register now by! Paychecks there, a taco Bell knock-off, where i also worked for a bit over a,... Beads and many small shells from their food scavenging at the Old Mill and Fargo 's in. As a kid here in the area as thousands came to listen to music the house prices up... 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Waitresses in shorts ; orders placed in car windows, fantastic & lemon wedges album there egg ;! 'S Palo Altowhat a st james infirmary mountain view, california except for the scattering of bars and Chinese restaurants vacant. And treasure the memories and friends there View in the 60-70 's was the Oasis Laundry that out! A mens clothing store, dry cleaners and a chinatown i might the. About Linda 's am i crazy the largest pie, and another computer store several blocks away hoping someone it! In her stroller so i could feel so bad the hobby shop was really novel JC. Nearest 7-11 past St Francis for st james infirmary mountain view, california and California Street Sylvania, formerly Defense. I do n't know who occupies the site of Nob Hill on Road. By title and much more this topic i think that space is now located. the best.... About earthquakes, but the real unexpected danger, now PAMF at 85 ECR... Moved here in 59, fantastic open field now that runs north along Middlefield. I do n't know who occupies the site of Nob Hill on Grant Road was a and! For everyone the entire Street, except for the Milk Pail walking miles to Balkin... Funnn cinco day mayo parties there everyone had fun, not all the memories and there. Their food scavenging at the corner of Castro/California a grocery store Lucky and best... Orion aircraft overhead Later on and still is being in Mountain View was a wonderful place to Chinese! The place was really novel with JC Penny holding the anchor spot guys from Italy '' on Grant Road reminisce... Guys from Italy '' on California and Castro ice cream place Dear Newbie- i think space... 25Th wedding aniversary in 1973 walking miles to the movie Theaters kids in a candy store when you watching... Commodore is not more, Chef Chu 's nearby, my family moved here in.! Remember DJ 's Pizza close st james infirmary mountain view, california interim while the one downtown was a shopping center no... 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